CES 4.4.18 Bugs

City Economic Simulation DLC for Capitalism Lab
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megapolis
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CES 4.4.18 Bugs

Post by megapolis »

Hi David,

Here's the list of issues that are active in 4.4.18 CES setting

1. City Bonds. In inverse inflation setting they are not a subject to inflation. In the long run it will inevitably lead to all cities bancrupcy. It can make sense but then loan rates for bonds should be much lower (2-5% instead of current 10-12%). Or they have to be recalculated for inflation because it works this way in normal inflation setting.
2. Party Capital. Same story here. But to be honest I will be glad if it will stay as is.
3. General stores. As I mentioned before, general stores are useless in CES. I suspect that they were brought into a game as a replacement to a department store in CES. But AI never uses them in many store types environment. That's ok but it will be nice if in one retail store type environment the only store type left will be General Store instead of Department Store.
4. Not CES related but still. In Retail store type=one setting I still see all stores types in firm filters.
5. Not sure if it is CES related. AI companies do not update Real Estate Rent prices according to inflation when inflation is set to normal. I always use inverse inflation so I did not see this bug. Government owned buildings are not affected by this bug.

Regards,
megapolis
megapolis
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Re: CES 4.4.18 Bugs

Post by megapolis »

Three screenshots explaining bug in item 5

Here's an overview. economy is growing, need for real estate is constant but there's a lot of real estate for sale
real estate price bug 1.jpg
real estate price bug 1.jpg (1.09 MiB) Viewed 2045 times
Here's an apartment before I bought it. As you can see annual rent per square foot is 80.52
real estate price bug 2.jpg
real estate price bug 2.jpg (1.29 MiB) Viewed 2045 times
The moment after I bought the same apartment I set the price to 100%. And it became 194.91 ("annual rent per square foot" still is 80.52 which is useless)
real estate price bug 3.jpg
real estate price bug 3.jpg (1.3 MiB) Viewed 2045 times
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eleaza
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Re: CES 4.4.18 Bugs

Post by eleaza »

megapolis wrote: 1. City Bonds. In inverse inflation setting they are not a subject to inflation. In the long run it will inevitably lead to all cities bancrupcy. It can make sense but then loan rates for bonds should be much lower (2-5% instead of current 10-12%). Or they have to be recalculated for inflation because it works this way in normal inflation setting.
2. Party Capital. Same story here. But to be honest I will be glad if it will stay as is.
3. General stores. As I mentioned before, general stores are useless in CES. I suspect that they were brought into a game as a replacement to a department store in CES. But AI never uses them in many store types environment. That's ok but it will be nice if in one retail store type environment the only store type left will be General Store instead of Department Store.
4. Not CES related but still. In Retail store type=one setting I still see all stores types in firm filters.
5. Not sure if it is CES related. AI companies do not update Real Estate Rent prices according to inflation when inflation is set to normal. I always use inverse inflation so I did not see this bug. Government owned buildings are not affected by this bug.

Regards,
megapolis
I agree the 1 and 2 issues are oversight and needs to be adjust according to reverse inflation (right now political fund is a nice place to hide money without losing value, just can not withdraw them)

I do see AI build general stores, and I think they only more willingly to build them in survival mode. And I think it's quite vital for human players as well if really starting at low capital from a completely empty city.

4 is definitely a bug. As to 5 I also rarely use normal inflation, but it does look like a bug.
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David
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Re: CES 4.4.18 Bugs

Post by David »

1. City Bonds. In inverse inflation setting they are not a subject to inflation. In the long run it will inevitably lead to all cities bancrupcy. It can make sense but then loan rates for bonds should be much lower (2-5% instead of current 10-12%). Or they have to be recalculated for inflation because it works this way in normal inflation setting.
Will fix this.
2. Party Capital. Same story here. But to be honest I will be glad if it will stay as is.
Hmm... as you said, perhaps we should just let it stay as it is, if it is a plus for the gameplay. I don't think anybody will complain about it.
3. General stores. As I mentioned before, general stores are useless in CES. I suspect that they were brought into a game as a replacement to a department store in CES. But AI never uses them in many store types environment. That's ok but it will be nice if in one retail store type environment the only store type left will be General Store instead of Department Store.
As you mentioned above that you saw no advantage in using general stores to department stores, so why don't we just keep it as it is (keep using the department store for the one retail store type setting)?
4. Not CES related but still. In Retail store type=one setting I still see all stores types in firm filters.
I tested it and didn't get this bug. Could you send me your save game?
5. Not sure if it is CES related. AI companies do not update Real Estate Rent prices according to inflation when inflation is set to normal. I always use inverse inflation so I did not see this bug. Government owned buildings are not affected by this bug.
I saw your follow-up post and the screenshots. Could you please send me your save game as well for checking?
megapolis
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Re: CES 4.4.18 Bugs

Post by megapolis »

David wrote:
2. Party Capital. Same story here. But to be honest I will be glad if it will stay as is.
Hmm... as you said, perhaps we should just let it stay as it is, if it is a plus for the gameplay. I don't think anybody will complain about it.
That's reasonable. :)
David wrote:
3. General stores. As I mentioned before, general stores are useless in CES. I suspect that they were brought into a game as a replacement to a department store in CES. But AI never uses them in many store types environment. That's ok but it will be nice if in one retail store type environment the only store type left will be General Store instead of Department Store.
As you mentioned above that you saw no advantage in using general stores to department stores, so why don't we just keep it as it is (keep using the department store for the one retail store type setting)?
I did not mean that they cannot make profit or something like this. I only meant that AI does not use them.
Why do I want Department Stores to be replaced by General Stores? CES cities require more space and in the long run cities with 2x2 General Stores will be better from city space management perspective. 3x3 Department stores look a bit awkward in CES cities environment with lots of apartments. Also I expect AI companies to be more competitive with 2x2 General Stores but that's just a wild guess and a possible side effect of this change.
David wrote:
4. Not CES related but still. In Retail store type=one setting I still see all stores types in firm filters.
I tested it and didn't get this bug. Could you send me your save game?
My fault. Did not see that this bug is already fixed.
David wrote:
5. Not sure if it is CES related. AI companies do not update Real Estate Rent prices according to inflation when inflation is set to normal. I always use inverse inflation so I did not see this bug. Government owned buildings are not affected by this bug.
I saw your follow-up post and the screenshots. Could you please send me your save game as well for checking?
I just re-tested. Will PM you two different test save games. Both have the same bug.
megapolis
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Re: CES 4.4.18 Bugs

Post by megapolis »

Found additional bug in 4.4.18

A couple of patches ago there was a change in buying Real Estate from Government. Now if you try to buy it, government asks for a premium above the market price. Unfortunately there is a way to overrule this. If you own 75% of another company, you can transfer property between them. Government property also can be transferred to your company or a subsidiary using transfer firm interface.

Unfortunately I don't know a good solution to this. Because if this premium will be applied in transfer firm interface you will be able to transfer it to your subsidiary and then immediately transfer it back to your main company without this premium.
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David
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Re: CES 4.4.18 Bugs

Post by David »

Government property also can be transferred to your company or a subsidiary using transfer firm interface.
Could you please post a screenshot of the transfer firm interface that you were referring to? Will then look into it.
megapolis
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Re: CES 4.4.18 Bugs

Post by megapolis »

David wrote:
Government property also can be transferred to your company or a subsidiary using transfer firm interface.
Could you please post a screenshot of the transfer firm interface that you were referring to? Will then look into it.
Transfer and Demolish firm -> Transfer firm

In these two screenshots we can see the price difference of the same firm to be transferred in two different ways.

By the way this price premium feature is a kind of workaround. I really don't understand why apartment revenue does not affect market price. It already does so for Media firms where it is easy to pay 250m for a media company that makes good profit.
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buy firm with premium.jpg
buy firm with premium.jpg (1.32 MiB) Viewed 1964 times
transfer firm without premium.jpg
transfer firm without premium.jpg (1.37 MiB) Viewed 1964 times
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David
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Re: CES 4.4.18 Bugs

Post by David »

In the next version, you will not be able to transfer a firm from the government to your company.

Please see the attached screenshot.
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